View Full Version : Can Microsoft's Xbox be considered a failure after only a year?
Ioman
10-17-2002, 07:47 PM
Icrontic.com (http://www.icrontic.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Sections&file=index&req=viewarticle&artid=111&page=1) has just put up an article explaining why the Xbox is considered a failure even though the heavy duty console has been on the market for but a year. But does Microsoft really consider a 12% market share a failure? Something to keep in mind is that Sony and Nintendo have been in the console market for years, they are recognized names. Microsoft is a name normally associated with computer software. Video game consoles generally have shelf life years above and beyond a computer system. Will Microsoft give up on the Xbox? You can bet they don't.
Personally I am willing to bet that once Microsoft introduces MS Live this November, people will be begging for the gaming system by Christmas. I think that Microsoft’s online plans are brilliant in my opinion. One login/pass for every game. Only broadband users can enjoy the benefits of the built in networking which means less compatibility issues and a better gaming experience. Another thing to keep in mind is that if this does take off, they most likely will help the adoption rate of broadband. I don't think Microsoft is willing to give up this easily they are a company with multiple products. Nintendo has two, they would be much more susceptible to lack of sales. I also read that Microsoft will be lowering their price of the Xbox to $149.99 due to a new manufacturing process. This should help them quite a bit.
LinkDJ
10-19-2002, 12:36 AM
I hate consoles so very much...
Where do i get started? Oh, here:
Nonupgradable
Nowhere near as good as keyboard control
Games only appear on one of the 3 platforms
Consoles make game makers forget about the PC
Region restrictions
Using a TV as a monitor!
(xbox) paying for an adapter so you can watch dvd movies
Paying for online gaming
nonexistance of online gaming
having to get an adapter for online gaming
they're big, ugly, and dont match my stereo equipment
Microsoft.
they're expensive
hard to play downloaded games
games are expensive too
every console has only a couple good games
Halo.
Antialiasing? Where? (you'd think a gf3 could do a little AA on that low resolution tv monitor of yours)
Yell at me so i have an excuse to think of more. I know im wrong on some.
LinkDJ
10-19-2002, 12:39 AM
Games badly ported from a console to PC (like GTA3)
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?section_name=pub&aid=830
WELL, consider they have Updated the security 2 times, and a 3rd is on the way, AND they have outsourced and DOWNgraded the hardware SENCE its release...
I would say they havent even kept up with what the Atari 2600 DID. They had 6 versions and upgraded each one.
Ioman
10-19-2002, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by ECA
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?section_name=pub&aid=830
WELL, consider they have Updated the security 2 times, and a 3rd is on the way, AND they have outsourced and DOWNgraded the hardware SENCE its release...
I would say they havent even kept up with what the Atari 2600 DID. They had 6 versions and upgraded each one.
Ok, where did you find information that they have downgraded their hardware in the Xbox since its introduction? I think that is a load of BS man! ;)
I am not worried about the Xbox getting hacked for mod chips and new OS installs. That has happened with EVERY console in the past 5 years. Hell, even the Dreamcast had hacks and linux ported over to it. This is no big thing really.
llbbl
10-19-2002, 06:46 PM
Ok, where did you find information that they have downgraded their hardware in the Xbox since its introduction? I think that is a load of BS man!
What happened to taking everyone on their word? Now we all want a link to it, like that it proof that the fact is actually true. Who is to say that what is on the web page actually happened? MSFT could just as easily be pulling your leg, so to speak, as can ECA.
For instance the phony switch ad.
http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,55785,00.html
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ECA, how much did you want?
Im looking for the link....
How, many?? CD's....Lots. and more
Ioman
10-19-2002, 10:51 PM
Originally posted by vindisco
What happened to taking everyone on their word? Now we all want a link to it, like that it proof that the fact is actually true. Who is to say that what is on the web page actually happened? MSFT could just as easily be pulling your leg, so to speak, as can ECA.
For instance the phony switch ad.
http://www.wired.com/news/mac/0,2125,55785,00.html
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ECA, how much did you want?
Don't worry about finding a link, its all good. The reasosn why I acted rude is because I am an avid video gamer. I subscribe to about 5 different video game magazines and I also know a lot in general about the industry. if they had downgraded the hardware, i would have known. I do know that they are changing their manufacturing process so it is actually cheaper for them to manufacture the Xboxes thus the decrease in price. This usually is the case with the Semiconductor manufacturing process like the PS2 went through.
pdxflyboy
10-20-2002, 12:55 AM
hey one good thing about multiplayer on consoles is that people cant cheat!!!!
as long as people cant hook the console to a computer and rewrite software then console gaming will rule!!!
LinkDJ
10-20-2002, 01:24 AM
That is a good point.
but then there are test codes, that are used to test the game and get you to places to check for continuity, and game play. These codes generally are NOT removed, these are the cheat codes. And if someone gets them, they can still USE them.
llbbl
10-20-2002, 03:09 PM
Ioman -
That's cool I was just joking. I think ECA might have been reffering to something else. Maybe back when they decided to manufacture it in Mexico instead of the US. Who knows.
pdxflyboy -
There are alot of ways that you can cheat on the console games. Mod chips are the way to do it these days. Dreamcast was really easy to hack all you had to do is put in a boot disk.
When the consoles do get online gaming going then their will still be issues of trying to hack their characters someway or somehow. I think similar issues exist in the PC multiplayer market, but many of the large development companies have it under control. At this point I don't think that cheating is that widespread in the newer mulitplayer games. I mean you can't really cheat at Quake 3 or Neverwinter Nights or Everquest. While their might be a way, the secret isn't out to the masses and it is not widespread in most games.
Ioman
12-21-2002, 01:44 AM
Originally posted by pdxflyboy
hey one good thing about multiplayer on consoles is that people cant cheat!!!!
as long as people cant hook the console to a computer and rewrite software then console gaming will rule!!!
Well with Xbox hacks pretty common now, who is stopping anyone from cheating? Now that the Xbox live is out, what is stopping people from downloading content too? I am just waiting to hear the big news about a virus being downloaded to the Xbox. I mean, who makes anti-virus software for the Xbox? No one that I know of.
llbbl
12-21-2002, 08:18 AM
They make antivirus software for Linux and that is probably the OS you would be running if you are downloading content OTHER than what is needed to run X-Box Live games.
Vin,
Even running windows, Linux, and most other networking OS's.
There are certain programs that MUST be run.
IF Xbox is on the NET, a Virus can be sent to it using these protocols.
NOW, a Windows, linux, other virus shouldnt Affect the XBOX, but it WILL be loaded useing the Net protocols. IF a XBox Virus is CREATED, it WILL be suseptable. And with out protection to CHECK In/output DATA, it will not be able to control it.
Ioman
12-21-2002, 10:38 PM
Originally posted by ECA
Vin,
Even running windows, Linux, and most other networking OS's.
There are certain programs that MUST be run.
IF Xbox is on the NET, a Virus can be sent to it using these protocols.
NOW, a Windows, linux, other virus shouldnt Affect the XBOX, but it WILL be loaded useing the Net protocols. IF a XBox Virus is CREATED, it WILL be suseptable. And with out protection to CHECK In/output DATA, it will not be able to control it.
The Xbox's OS uses the Windows 2000 kernal, so it will most likely be vurnerable to any virus out there.
If thats true, then the BIOS can be Killed. THEN you have a PAPER WEIGHT for a console. and fixing it, will COST more then YOU want to pay. Cost me $30-50 to get an updated Bios chip.
senoryoshio
12-22-2002, 10:55 AM
I don't know about what has happened so far, but I''ve never heard anything about virii for say, an XBox, but playing online on a console is probably safer than turning my computer on and checking my email. I mean if someone really wanted to they could probably do all sorts of crazy junk to my machine, but someone could also run into me while I'm walking down the street...poor metaphor, sorry. I guess I'm just saying that I would chance playing a console online because I believe that the benefits far outweigh living in fear of possible infection. I know that a lot, probably not all, of those that have put mod chips in their XBox can not play their games online, and I think that is great....I've had enough trouble with cheating online already, I don't need it on a console as well.
Plus MechAssault looks like a ton o' fun....
Mechassult?
I wish theyd do a followup on Heavy gear 2.. IT WAS COOL, and FAST.
llbbl
12-22-2002, 05:05 PM
Originally posted by Ioman
The Xbox's OS uses the Windows 2000 kernal, so it will most likely be vurnerable to any virus out there.
It's all a matter of figuring out the protocols that X-Box uses to connect to other users. You would have a very difficult time of it and the virus wouldn't spread as fast as they do on the PC because it wouldn't have all the tools that are usually available to it. While it is possible, its very unlikely that someone would go to all this trouble.
A big hurdle is the fact that they connect to a central M$ server to see who is willing to play a certain game. That is how they can have one login for all the games.
---
side note
NES systems are damn expensive !! I want to find a controler that looks like the old one, but works for the PC. That way you can play all the emu's w/ most of the look and feel.
IronSerif
12-23-2002, 06:39 AM
OT Note about the xBox:
I'm not sure if this applies to just our area, but the Electronic Boutique's around here have a trade in deal for an xBox. Basically, you trade in a Playstation 2, with power cord, and 2 games (might be 3), and I'm also not sure if you have to trade in a controller or not. But you get a new xBox, with a rebate for 2 games. From what I heard, you have to send in this rebate form and they send you two games.
I'm sure some people will like this deal while others won't. But I know a friend that is going to do it, so I figured I would just let everyone know :)
llbbl
12-23-2002, 08:27 AM
Originally posted by IronSerif
OT Note about the xBox:
I'm not sure if this applies to just our area, but the Electronic Boutique's around here have a trade in deal for an xBox. Basically, you trade in a Playstation 2, with power cord, and 2 games (might be 3), and I'm also not sure if you have to trade in a controller or not. But you get a new xBox, with a rebate for 2 games. From what I heard, you have to send in this rebate form and they send you two games.
...
What is OT stand for? On topic?
So you could save like $50 bucks if you went out and bought a playstation + 2 games and then went and traded them in?
IronSerif
12-23-2002, 08:50 AM
OT - Off Topic
I guess certain people would find this as a deal, not too sure.
I like the deal myself.
I wonder if Nintendo is gonna do anything crazy like this or not?
Iv seen this happen before.
With XBox haveing all this Advertising out. And PS2 dont have as much out. They are Showing themselve(XBOX) that they have the market, and the games to back it up. EVEN if they are NOT the best machine, ppl will see it as, THEY have the market and games. What MOST dont realize, is that the PS2 can play the PS1 GAMES.
PS1 in this area is about $50.
Its a marketing ploy. The MORE they have the XBox ON TV, more ppl will think its the MORE popular machine.
IronSerif
12-23-2002, 10:53 AM
Originally posted by ECA
Its a marketing ploy. The MORE they have the XBox ON TV, more ppl will think its the MORE popular machine.
Yep, I definately agree with that. And that's not just limited to consoles, but other electronics as well!
llbbl
12-23-2002, 12:55 PM
I think pretty much any gamer older than 14 is going to know the differences between the consoles. It doesn't matter if they have MORE advertising for the X-Box, this isn't going to make it more popular. It is a combination of the good reviews from people whom already own one with perhaps a catchy ad that previews a game that the customer might like. I see alot of PS2 commercials out these days also. It might depend on what channel you watch. Maybe M$ is spending more on advertising because they are broadcasting on alot of channels where as the Devil, err I mean sony is limiting their range of channels.
Its also Nievaty(sp) of the consumer.
BELIEVE what is SAID, not WHAT you know.
And they are aiming at the 12-18 year olds. That dont have the knowledge to compare.
senoryoshio
12-24-2002, 12:35 PM
Originally posted by ECA
...And they are aiming at the 12-18 year olds. That dont have the knowledge to compare. [/B]
and this is how it has been done for ages...it would be silly, business-wise, to do it any other way (never underestimate the power of a whining 11-year old.) At least as far as I could tell, I'm no biz-wiz though
That, and Video games aimed at 12 years of age.
TV aimed at the same.
It doesnt advance us. And then they wonder WHY we are falling behind, in the tech race, Building, and just about everything else.
senoryoshio
12-24-2002, 03:13 PM
I never really thought that video games, and their subsequent advertising were in place to advance us a country, race, culture etc. Our country is supposed to have institutions in place to teach skills required for technological advancements...I don't really think that we can place blame for a "lagging behind"on companies like Microsoft not matter how much you don't like them or what they do.
To a large point, you can.
If every thing you see is geared for the 6th grade. You wont THINK above the 6th grade.
If you dint read Above the 6th grade level, you are STUCK at the 6th grade level.
Our sociaty is geared for those that DONT read. Generally, those that read, READ higher and higher quality books. Ever read the Silmarilian? HARD book. Took me 3 months. Harry potter(all 4 books) took 2 weeks. Those that are Grphically oreinted, are aimed only towards the 6th grade. Unless you like puzzles, and graphs you wont get PASSED the 6th grade material.
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